Hello, all;

This was sparked by a comment by GrungyDan on Twitter, and echoed my own, recent thinking.

First, it's a given that we like Fear The Boot, or we probably wouldn't be here. There are a few other gaming podcasts I really enjoy, but surprisingly few. Many seem to be pale echo's of better established shows, adding little in the way of meaningful content.

Do you agree with this or am I talking hooey? What are some gaming podcasts doing right? What are some gaming podcasts doing wrong? What did you wish they wouldn't do? What do you wish they'd do more of? And, what podcast that is not currently available, do you wish someone would produce?

[Note: I'm being careful not to name names and insult podcast hosts. You may do what you like, but I reccomend treading carefully.]

I liked Have Games, Will Travel for its informative look at individual games. After listening to an episode I felt like I could rock up to a game starting up at a con and someone would ask "have you played this before?" and I'd say "no, but I've heard of it and have a good idea of the general gist". It also covered a lot of ground so I'd get to hear about stuff like board games and card games that I probably wouldn't otherwise encounter. Unfortunately that same depth made it somewhat dry listening, as did the single-host format, and when I wasn't mentally switched on I have fallen asleep listening to it.

Still though, because he's excellent I followed Paul Tevis across to The Voice of the Revolution, which is more official and advertisey, but for stuff I think is cool so that's okay. I think the standardised structure does it good, because it forces a certain amount of effort be put in - gotta find someone to interview, that kind of thing. The two hosts makes it a bit more lively but I still don't think it's enough, and it had sound quality issues for ages because the hosts are geographically separate.

If I started listening to Fear the Boot now I don't know what I'd think. The multi-host banter format is great, but I think it was the advice that brought me in at first and the advice wells have run somewhat dry - now it's more discussion than assistance. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's less valuable, if you know what I mean. It's fun listening, but that's pretty much the only reason I listen to it now, I don't feel like I learn much from it. No harm in fun though.

The Gamer Traveler was more fun in concept than in execution, I think - I've often thought about incorporating stuff I've seen while traveling into games, but I don't think that translated too well to the monologue format. I don't find other peoples' travel stories too interesting if they're about places and sights, and I have no interest in Tolkienesque fantasy or whatever the catch-all term is, and that podcast focussed heavily on those which made it not really gel with my own particular tastes. Great idea, though.

That's the extent of my gaming podcast listening, but as it happens I'm in the process of starting up my own gaming podcast (test episode being recorded tomorrow evening) about the Irish gaming scene with a part-banter, part-informative-and-news format. Borrowing from Fear the Boot and Voice of the Revolution, the plan is to have four hosts (less than three is a bit dry, more than four is a bit chaotic) and definite sections - event reports, event previews, interviews, 3rd party advice, mini reviews of what the hosts are playing lately and so on.

Therefore I'm VERY interested to see what this thread turns up because I'd love to know what people like and dislike.

What about you, Runester? You didn't express much in the way of opinions there.

I am also inclined to not name specific shows, because even if I don't like the show, they're still doing it and putting in the effort.

It just seems that most of the other casts I've tried out lately fall flat for one of a few reasons:

- I don't like the hosts: very subjective, and I couldn't tell you specifically what will put me off, but if I don't dig the hosts much I won't listen

- They are boring as hell: some of these guys sound like that high school coach that also happened to teach Civics, and they drone on and on until you realize you've been asleep for an hour.

- Like Runester said, nothing in the way of new content. That explains itself, really.

and the one that I've decided is the biggest annoyance in a podcast,

- Talking about nothing, and even managing to do that in such a random fashion that you can't tell what they're even trying to say. I ran across this in two shows I checked out today. They get on the mics, and just start talking about nothing. Seriously, that's not interesting, stop it.

Banter and meandering are one thing, and I enjoy it, but I mean these guys come on and it's just a stream of consciousness rambling through whatever seems to come to mind. I was listening to one "gaming" podcast and 3/4 of the way in, they hadn't really talked about gaming yet. Ridiculous. At least don't purport to be a gaming podcast, then.

I dunno. There are a lot of shows out there right now. I went through the entire Spooky Outhouse lineup today, and of them I might listen to two of them (in addition to the Podge Cast, of course) in a pinch. I've checked out random shows that come up when you search iTunes. I've probably given 10 or so new (to me) shows a chance in the last few days, and I might, might listen to two of them.

I have / do listen to each of the podcasts you describe, and agree with you fully. I've found that listening to a single person for extended periods of time is BORING, even if they have good information. Further, I think podcasters need to take a page from traditional media's book and break up their content. TV and radio shows have commercial breaks, section bumbers, sound effects, and other means of breaking up the monotony of one persons voice droning on and on.

The second most common format is the "group banter" but I am learning that it is much harder then perhaps FtB makes it look. The other shows wander all over the place, have a lot of inside jokes or crude humor (as in, hilarious for a 14 year old, not so much for a 38 year old) and also display little useful content or experience. I won't say who, but I will add that they mean well, are obviously having fun, and get beau coup points for actually doing the work and putting out the eps. BUT, they seem to do little or no show prep, and mostly just jam a few friends together in a room to gab in front of a recorder. It's not compelling enough for me to dedicate an hour to every week!

Also, podcasting while drunk isn't nearly as much fun for the audience as the podcasters may think. A beer or two can loosen everyone up and get them relaxed and talking. But having hosts rant obscenities on random and randomly skipping topics while recording it all ... does not a great show make. [Of course, this is just my opinion. I'm sure other listeners must find it very amusing and come back for more.]

Another thing I'm not that happy with is GenCon and news coverage, mostly because all of the podcasts that cover it, use the same stories! When D&D 4e was released, I got pretty darn sick of hearing the same thing over and over across shows. I know that it can't be helped, somewhat, but I'd really hope that each podcast would find a way to put a unique spin on it or find a fresh story to share. Also, many podcast interviews are little more then unpaid commercial product advertisements. That may be why so many RPG companies are willing to give interview after interview to podcaster after podcaster, especially at a venue like GenCon. But, as a listener they only have a limited appeal. Sometimes I hear about a new product I may be interested in, but mostly I have to listen to a marketer run through a spiel about something I don't care about. That's one of the reasons I enjoyed the FtB interview series so much. These weren't just corporate schills, they were interesting people with something to share, and Dan et. al. obviously did enough research to ask the right questions to engage the guest. That is a far cry from popping into someone's booth and saying, "tell me about the current game you're selling!" [This may have it's place, but there is a limit!]

I also feel that going "explicit" does not necessarily add much. Many of the programs I enjoy the most (FtB, All Games Considered, Son's of Kryos, Indie Press Revolution) are not explicit and tend to have a higher content quotient then shows that pride themselves on their freedom to say what they please. This may be counter intuitive, since self censorship and post-production editing on "clean" shows should be a negative ... and yet the "explicit" shows are often the rambling, sophomoric humor fests and not the deep, adult discussions they may have imagined. Now, I'm not opposed to an explicit gaming podcast, and the unedited interview with Luke Crane is a good reason why that can work just fine. But it's not as common as you may believe.

Finally, I'm growing weary of the "advice" meta-topic. This may be fatigue borne from having listened to gaming podcasts for a few years now and having heard far more advice then I can ever remember or use. I really think "discussion" is the way things are moving for a reason. Many times, the hosts do not know any better then the listeners how to do or handle something. All they can offer is their own experience and opinions; and the hosts may not even agree on these. So, they discuss it. Then, on the forums, their listeners discuss it. The model of "expert teaches student" is replaced by "peers discuss their experiences" and is closer to the real relationship most podcast hosts have with their listeners. [This may not be true of an educational podcast or a technical podcast where the host is assumed to have much more knowledge or experience then the listeners; but RPG podcasts rarely fall in this category.]



This is one of my own, secret motives for starting this topic. One of my goals for 2009 is to start my own podcast. I need to decide on a general topic, format, and a means to present it. Will I have cohosts? [Unlikely.] Will it be an hour long rant? [No way!] Will I dole out unwanted advice from my own limited experiences? [Not if I want people to listen.] So, I'm working on finding a niche that is either un-served or under-served and a format that will be palatable to listeners. Further, with the many, many podcasts out there, any new one will have to do something to stand out.

So, you made the 'mistake' of asking for my opinion. I think I may have provided more then you expected! While I'm at it, I would hope that more forum goers jump in and add something; but to be fair, they may not have put as much thought into this topic as you, GrungyDan, and I.

Right thing: lively, multi-party discussion that is neither riveted to one given topic and scattered hither and yon across everything but gaming. Fear the Boot does this, but also Dragon's Landing Inn, All Games Considered and Role Playing Public Radio.

Wrong thing: this is applicable to more than gaming podcasts, but not understanding the technology one's using to record a show. There are way too many podcasts consisting of people on USB headsets talking over each other because they can't learn to compensate for the delay, while at the same time being inaudible.

This also includes people who like to record interviews on the floor of an exhibition hall and don't quite grasp how to wield their microphone most effectively.

Seconded. Paul Tevis may have the most astounding insights into Random New Game, but I'll never know because listening to him drone on almost sent me off the road into a ditch on more than one occasion.

Thanks for the feedback; I very much appreciate it. I'm going to be retooling TGT this year, so I will looking at this closely, and probably asking for more honest feedback later on.

Carry on.

To go slightly off-topic ... My first and favorite ep of Gamer Traveler was the one you did with your wife about your honey moon in Ireland. I listened to it, and then listened to it again with my fiancee. Having your wife there and sharing such specific memories (having the journal must have helped) was great! I was surprised that your other ep's were in a different format. I really think having the co-host share the experience with you made a big difference.

I think I know at least one of the podcasts that you are referring to. What seems like a really likable group of people, who would probably be a blast drinking with at a bar or shooting the shit with over wings and a pitcher of beer ... seem to be podcasting for the sake of podcasting and are offering very little to their listeners. There is always hope that they'll learn and refine their efforts. I hope they do! Or, they may find and carve out a niche that no one currently suspects. Or, they may see the lack of (much) positive feedback as despiriting and podfade. But, for a group that has the wherewithal and gumption to get together regularly and record and edit and post and maintain an attendant site ... I have to believe there is hope.

Positives:
- Australian accent: I don't know what it is, and I'm perfectly happy to listen to foreign podcasts, but it's far more easier for more to relate to an Australian than a foreigner no matter how much I like the latter more. Though arguably, I stopped listening to a war gaming podcast because even though I am familiar with the hobby, and I loved the show, I just wasn't interested in their guests or interviewees.

- Experience in hobby: I know one would assume if someone was making a podcast they would have experience with the subject matter. However, if I were to start a podcast tomorrow with a couple of my gaming friends we wouldn't have much to say. This is perhaps why I enjoy Fear the Boot so much, even though they jokingly didn't come out of mid-90's gaming for a while, I've been able to learn so much from their own experiences that I'm sure that it has shaped my own gaming for the next decade of my life.